Master Collection Changes

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JTB123
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Master Collection Changes

Post by JTB123 » Thu Jun 10, 2021 3:15 pm

Will make another forum if there are enough changes to warrant it. I'll just update this as I go through the game and note down any that I find.

Sigma 1:

Mission mode time scoring is like NGB and NGS, not like it was in the actual Vita version. More testing needed but 200k difference between mission 1 so far.
Bow changed to aim button and now cannot just be block cancelled. A/X has to be pressed at the same time.
Interact button is now B/Circle like in the Vita version.
Awakened Alma gave me a kill bonus on Normal.
Save clock timer is in minutes and seconds as opposed to hours and mins like before, unsure if it will max out at 999:99
Karma window bugs out every now and then where you have to turn it on and off again to show time, kills etc.
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Re: Master Collection Changes

Post by Alhazard » Thu Jun 10, 2021 8:21 pm

Sigma 1:

EDIT: Confirmed getting hit while in bow aiming mode (like with a bullet) cancels aiming mode.
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JTB123
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Re: Master Collection Changes

Post by JTB123 » Fri Jun 11, 2021 10:40 am

I tested that as well and it seems very inconsistent. Against a normal soldiers assault rifle I got knocked out of aiming mode every time. Against the turrets in chapter 11 they didn't knock me out of it, maybe it's due to distance or what inputs you are buffering. I always hold block+X to cancel the aiming mode so maybe that over rides it sometimes, will definitely look into this more. The turret on the tank always seemed to knock me out of it too.
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jaunger1999
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Re: Master Collection Changes

Post by jaunger1999 » Fri Jun 11, 2021 12:10 pm

Does anyone know if they fixed the input delay in Razor's Edge?
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Re: Master Collection Changes

Post by Alhazard » Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:05 pm

The Dabi doppleganger fiend now blocks Dabi UTs :flame: :flame: :flame:
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wyansas
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Re: Master Collection Changes

Post by wyansas » Sat Jun 12, 2021 3:55 am

jaunger1999 wrote:
Fri Jun 11, 2021 12:10 pm
Does anyone know if they fixed the input delay in Razor's Edge?
I too am curious as to any differences between the backwards compatible 360 version and the MC version of Razor's Edge. The MC version download size is 1.3 GB smaller than the back compat version.

Only difference I've noticed so far is that they seem to have patched the scarab glitch. I haven't been able to get it to work yet.
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Royta
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Re: Master Collection Changes

Post by Royta » Sat Jun 12, 2021 2:24 pm

Sigma 2 and Razor's Edge have their trials nerfed into the fucking ground. Not only is the AI extremely competent at parts, the damage you do is insane. I did nearly 33% damage to Volf with a team-ninpo - it's scary. Cleared UN1 on my third attempt with extremely rusty reactions and bad play in Sigma 2.

Sigma 2 has some issues with 360 moves. Regular 360 inputs from the Dragon Sword are missing a large part of their hitbox and tracking, same with the 360UT. The Y-counter of the Dragon Sword can now also no longer chain into an Izuna which is...weird.

Razor's Edge is missing the Scarab glitch and of course half its customizablity (no Unknown Ninja).

Either my knowledge of Sigma is getting mixed up with Black in my head, or the Fiend Ryu now blocks the XY dabi infinite.

One last (positive) change is that Mentor is unlocked from the get go in NGS2 and Hard in NGS, making it require less runs of us to actually get to Master Ninja.

Edit: it is, with propper timing, to do both a regular ninpo and team-ninpo at the same time in NGS2 Tag Mission. You do:
- ninpo with character
- immediately swap
- just as the original shoots the ninpo you also do ninpo
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unwary
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Re: Master Collection Changes

Post by unwary » Sun Jun 13, 2021 12:57 am

Just to note, both Sigma 1 and Sigma 2 are the Vita versions that have been remastered to be HD with copied ps3 assets.

In ps3 sigma, you can partially skip the water chapter with a chest. In MC Sigma and Vita Sigma, that chest is placed differently to prevent the oob. Also the crosshair is exactly the same as it was from the Vita version.
For MC Sigma 2, look at the UI elements. The ninpo flames under the life bar are animated at what looks like 15fps. In 4k, the inventory menu shows overblown dithering on the font.

This confirms the general public opinion that the Master Collection is a bare bones port.
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wyansas
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Re: Master Collection Changes

Post by wyansas » Sun Jun 13, 2021 3:06 am

unwary wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 12:57 am
This confirms the general public opinion that the Master Collection is a bare bones port.
And since they are just ports, they probably could have included NGB and NGII in the collection. They released them on the XB1 just fine, they could have included them here.
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unwary
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Re: Master Collection Changes

Post by unwary » Sun Jun 13, 2021 10:47 pm

I heard it was impossible to get all weapons upgraded in ps3 sigma 2. In mc sigma 2, it is possible to upgrade all your weapons
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Re: Master Collection Changes

Post by unwary » Mon Jun 14, 2021 2:39 am

I was using the tonfas and realized MC Sigma 2 doesn't show the heavenly justice cancel for garland drop, the 4 string version is there but it omits the actually good one.
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Royta
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Re: Master Collection Changes

Post by Royta » Mon Jun 14, 2021 8:15 am

Apparently the Izuna Drop for the Tonfa is broken right now too, the launcher goes too high all of a sudden, making the follow-up hits wiff. Also hearing notes of Eli's blockable attacks at random times just piercing block, would explain why I was getting clipped by her from time to time without understanding why.
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Re: Master Collection Changes

Post by julius-ruler4 » Mon Jun 14, 2021 11:54 pm

Have any changes been made to the time/kill limits?

And if yes, please send them here
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Re: Master Collection Changes

Post by Alhazard » Tue Jun 15, 2021 8:06 am

no changes to Sigma times/kills
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Re: Master Collection Changes

Post by Farnham The Drunk » Tue Jun 15, 2021 8:47 am

I do not know if this info fits the threat here, but in sigma 2 some of the sound effects of Ryu's kicks are missing when OT-ing with the Flail / Kusa... Just straight up missing.
And i can cofirm the buggy Tonfa Izuna, especially the XXXY XXXY Izuna works 1% of the time if you get lucky... Baffling

I also noticed that in sigma 1 the ogre's side swing with the big club actually guard crushes now, very infuriating since it only guard broke in black... makes it tough to dodge his tripple swing now... Guard reset is basically useless for blocking it now... Thx hayashi :flame:
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JTB123
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Re: Master Collection Changes

Post by JTB123 » Tue Jun 15, 2021 9:25 am

The horizontal guard crush on the Ogres was in original Sigma too, it doesn't always guard crush though which is weird.
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Re: Master Collection Changes

Post by Farnham The Drunk » Tue Jun 15, 2021 9:44 am

JTB123 wrote:
Tue Jun 15, 2021 9:25 am
The horizontal guard crush on the Ogres was in original Sigma too, it doesn't always guard crush though which is weird.
ah ok thx, did not know that... :)

Oh, another thing i noticed, Heavenly Justice works kinda differently in sigma 2... In vanilla 2, with a simple press of A Ryu would just magnetize to the enemy he was attacking, so after a FS f.e. perfectly setting up a followup... In sigma 2 tho, ryu just keeps moving in the direction the FS was going, ignoring the enemy position, making followups clunky and sometimes even wiff... Another very bad change to the Tonfa combat...
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Re: Master Collection Changes

Post by Massaca » Tue Jun 15, 2021 2:34 pm

Tonfa's were too good so they had to ruin them

Jokes aside, has anyone here played the Vita version of NGS2 to compare these complaints to? Just wondering if these were all in that version already and just never fixed or if they're new to the rereleases. So far I've done the first fight on NGS Hard and one mission. Yet to really get to playing it.

Hilarious but sad that there isn't even a resolution option in-game on PC.
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Royta
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Re: Master Collection Changes

Post by Royta » Tue Jun 15, 2021 4:01 pm

Played the vita versions and all these bugs weren't in those releases, this is definitely an MC issue. There's definitely something going wrong with Sigma 2 in this release, maybe since they combined the versions. The Sigma 1 included in the collection is just straight up the VITA version, while the Sigma 2 game is the PS3 game with some Vita content hacked in it seems.
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Re: Master Collection Changes

Post by unwary » Wed Jun 16, 2021 4:02 am

Royta wrote:
Tue Jun 15, 2021 4:01 pm
Played the vita versions and all these bugs weren't in those releases, this is definitely an MC issue. There's definitely something going wrong with Sigma 2 in this release, maybe since they combined the versions. The Sigma 1 included in the collection is just straight up the VITA version, while the Sigma 2 game is the PS3 game with some Vita content hacked in it seems.
Just finished SIgma 1 Plus today, the chest placements of Plus and MC are probably identical. There's that extra chest in ch1 that has the Lives of the Thousand Gods, same room as the FS chest. PS3 Sigma has the extra chest near the door.

I'll get around the S2 Plus tomorrow.
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Re: Master Collection Changes

Post by Royta » Wed Jun 16, 2021 6:43 am

One thing that's new, and pretty sweet, is that doing the DLC stuff unlocks things early.

Source:
"All gold on Weapon Master Unlocks All Difficulties and Ryu's Costumes, Gold on Speed Master Unlocks all Ninja Trials, and Gold on Rachel Master Unlocks all of her Hairstyles."
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Re: Master Collection Changes

Post by julius-ruler4 » Wed Jun 16, 2021 9:36 am

Having played all three of them, I can conclude that, IMO, Sigma 2 is by far my personal favorite.

Sigma 1 needs some tweaks to get it well polished
NG3:RE needs a few tweaks too
Sigma 2: could use some tweaks, but so far I like it the best

Damn shame NGB and NG2 aren't in this collection
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Re: Master Collection Changes

Post by Farnham The Drunk » Wed Jun 16, 2021 5:18 pm

today i noticed that the Scythe's River Styx Drop (->YYYXY) does not connect either, just like tonfa Izuna... and then i realized why... The inputs cannot be buffered in anymore like a normal combo, u have to delay certain inputs for the drops to work, in the Scythes case, delay the last Y, then Ryu actually connects... in the tonfas case u have to delay the 4th X (in XXXY (X) XXY) to compensate for Ryu launching the enemy too high... so there ya go, the drops work ,just gotta input them in a weird way... still poorly programmed and very infuriating...
Last edited by Farnham The Drunk on Thu Jun 17, 2021 8:26 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Master Collection Changes

Post by Murphy's Ghost » Wed Jun 16, 2021 10:27 pm

So against my better judgment I bought this collection, to support the series.

And my god... it's not even the actual NGS and NGS2, but screwed up / glitchy ports of the freaking Vita versions? I don't even think I'm going to bother playing it, I got through a few chapters of NGS and it feels even more off than NGS felt from Black. Will just go back to playing NGB and NGII on the xb1.


Good game Team Ninja, hope you use my money to make an NG4 that doesn't suck... :headbash:
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Re: Master Collection Changes

Post by Trax » Sat Jun 19, 2021 3:57 am

Time to wait until we can play NG2 on Windows 11 :(
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