Started playing this again.

PLATFORM: Xbox, Xbox 360 (emulation); RELEASE: March 2004 (NGB: September 2005)

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Kazama Jin
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Re: Started playing this again.

Post by Kazama Jin » Mon Dec 17, 2012 4:37 am

Man, I wanted to play NGB again. Mainly because 180Y with the TDS is beast. and 360Y is beast.

And because the no UT play in NGB is alot more deliberate and balanced.

Glad people are playing this again. Also, slightly related:

Can you use 360Y to dodge dynamo's grab? can't remember if that works.
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Re: Started playing this again.

Post by Marsbar » Mon Dec 17, 2012 4:06 pm

Hmmmm :think: .....i don't think 360 Y will save you from the grab....else you could just spam 360 Y to defeat Dynamo. Never really tried that so I don't know for sure.

Rolling and Ninpo work.
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Re: Started playing this again.

Post by Murphy's Ghost » Mon Dec 17, 2012 4:46 pm

Unless you mean mission mode, you won't have the level 3 DS for Dynamo.
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Re: Started playing this again.

Post by Massaca » Tue Dec 18, 2012 12:37 am

Pretty sure he's normal the normal 360 Y which is at Lv.2.
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Re: Started playing this again.

Post by Murphy's Ghost » Tue Dec 18, 2012 3:21 am

Massaca wrote:Pretty sure he's normal the normal 360 Y which is at Lv.2.
Are you sure? I could've sworn it was lv 3 in both games (NGB and NG2).

Eh, wouldn't be the first time my memory's failed me. :wink:
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Re: Started playing this again.

Post by Massaca » Tue Dec 18, 2012 3:30 am

Yeah, pretty sure. Never use it much though. It's always the OL X one that I forget. I think that one's Lv.3 but maybe not.
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Re: Started playing this again.

Post by Ninja Noob » Tue Dec 18, 2012 4:14 am

Kazama j wrote:And because the no UT play in NGB is alot more deliberate and balanced.
Cool are you recording? I like no UT plays.

Speaking of my current playing: I'm not playing frequently, and because of it hard it is a bit too challenging for me, so I'm replaying normal, I'm practicing a little bit more what I learned. I'm in the aquaduct, I reached it in less than six hours, but the game is still challenging for me (but in a fair way). I'm liking it, I'm having fun, I'm happy :D
It is for sure the masterpiece many player talk about.

I also try the missions: very challenging, too hard for my current skill, but I suppose they can be good to practice boss fights or specific weapons.

Now that I learned a bit of the system, the temptation to try NG2 is so strong, but it's better to stick to this and enjoy it for the most he can offer. Anyways I feel I would enjoy NG2 more than this. I'll see!
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Re: Started playing this again.

Post by iraqoz » Tue Dec 18, 2012 11:05 am

Kazama jin wrote:Man, I wanted to play NGB again. Mainly because 180Y with the TDS is beast. and 360Y is beast.

And because the no UT play in NGB is alot more deliberate and balanced.

Glad people are playing this again. Also, slightly related:

Can you use 360Y to dodge dynamo's grab? can't remember if that works.
Iam not sure, but if you play NGS you can own him with DCTF 360T :smile:. It does not have i-frame like NGS2/NG2 but its incredibly effective specially against him.
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Re: Started playing this again.

Post by Marsbar » Tue Dec 18, 2012 4:32 pm

Ninja Noob,

If I get some of the specifics wrong I'm sure the other folks will help me out. :D A couple other tips that most new players don't really know about that makes NGB much easier. Generally, Ryu can hold block against almost all fiends at least for the first couple of hits. Depending on the fiend/trooper his guard can be simply broken or crushed. When it is broken he takes no damage, but the next hit will give damage. When his guard gets crushed he takes a little damage and gets staggered where he can get hit for big damage. The solution to getting guard broken or crushed is to roll right after the event. His roll animation gives a couple i-frames and therefore he takes no damage and leaves no opening. He can also attack immediately after the roll. This technique is super useful against certain fiends....Berzerkers comes to mind. A keystroke combination that works really well is.....LT, guard broken or crushed, Left Stick to roll (backwards usually), >Y. You can also immediately go to a windpath or a flying swallow right after the roll. Lots of possibilities.

The other tip is that if you can't see the fiend on the screen they generally don't attack; and fiends that throw orbs (mages and berzerkers) wont attack you with them. So you can set Ryu in a corner, facing the corner, and wait. Eventually a fiend will get into the field of view and Ryu (you) get first crack at him. Ryu gives damage without taking any. Get back in the corner or a different corner and repeat. It doesn't even have to be a corner...anywhere you can put Ryu that is kinda out of the way will work. Ryu can also charge up to an ET/UT while parked in the corner waiting for the fiend to enter the field of view. Smart use of the camera (right stick) can be used to keep the fiends out of the field of view.

These techniques are really well illustrated in most of the videos...for sure in Reim's, Bigalski's, and Balbaid's. Pretty sure Reims videos explain what is going on when he does it.

These techniques also work in NG2, but not quite so well. In NG2 it is better to keep moving and be more aggressive.
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Re: Started playing this again.

Post by Murphy's Ghost » Tue Dec 18, 2012 8:22 pm

OK, just booted up NGB.

Had a Hard file sitting at the start of Chapter 2. So.. there goes the afternoon, basically. At least until I hit the underground. Hate fighting Ghuls. :facepalm2:


Anyway, Gleaming Blade (360 Y) with the DS is a lv 3 technique, so it won't be available for Dynamo in story mode. In mission mode I recall the charged variant (with the Plasma Sabre in that mission, pretty sure) is quite effective, not sure if uncharged 360 Y is safe but you could likely time it in between his grab attempts if you wanted.


Iraquoz is also right about NGS Dynamo- the DCTF 360 Y is very effective.
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Re: Started playing this again.

Post by Patrask » Wed Dec 19, 2012 12:03 am

Isn't 360Y with lvl.2 DS just a pirouette? :silly: AFAIK there's only one point in the game where it's actually useful, and even then it's debatable as ->Y can just as easily be used as well. Pretty sure it can get interrupted, so not safe against Dynamo grabs either.
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Re: Started playing this again.

Post by Massaca » Wed Dec 19, 2012 12:19 am

Murphy's Ghost wrote:Anyway, Gleaming Blade (360 Y) with the DS is a lv 3 technique, so it won't be available for Dynamo in story mode.
Hmm, guess I was wrong then. But it got me wondering so I loaded NGS and it was Lv.2 in it so maybe I remembered wrong or something :shrug:
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Re: Started playing this again.

Post by Murphy's Ghost » Wed Dec 19, 2012 12:21 am

Patrask wrote:Isn't 360Y with lvl.2 DS just a pirouette? :silly:

Yeah, you're right- good memory! Looking at the move list again, at level 2 a move called "Flying Crane" is unlocked and the input is 360 Y. And right underneath is Gleaming Blade and the two charge variants, all locked 'til level 3. Flying Crane is just as you say- it actually looks quite a lot like the BotA 360 Y in NG2, but with only 1 sword.

Sooo Gleaming Blade must be 360 Y (hold) in this game, that's the issue.

Well I feel silly now. Sorry, Massaca, you WERE right. And I'm on Chapter 6 now so I've missed my chance to test this Flying Crane move on Dynamo. Damnit. :picard: :laugh2:
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Re: Started playing this again.

Post by Kazama Jin » Wed Dec 19, 2012 3:14 am

Man. I may be wrong then, but I could've sworn I'd found some anti-grab properties on the TDS 360Y no UT. I thought I remember BSC ninjas not being able to grab you if the animation already went off. I may be making up stuff. :T Yea MG it was in mission mode I think. May have been in sigma where he comes back or something, I forget. I'm probably not remembering right.

@Ninja noob - nah i can't record anything for NGB, and I feel like it's a bit late anyway. :p My no UT play in NGB is nowhere near all of the crazy shinobier/whoever else/no hurt stuff that people have done. I'd really have to play alot more to try and get to a level like that.


And level 2 DS 180Y is badass! Very little in a ps2 xbox era action game looks quite as crisp as when you time 180Y perfectly and instantly decap a rushing IS ninja. It's also pretty safe, if you are in falling motion, you can immediately counter.
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Re: Started playing this again.

Post by iraqoz » Wed Dec 19, 2012 4:06 am

Kazama jin wrote: @Ninja noob - nah i can't record anything for NGB, and I feel like it's a bit late anyway. :p My no UT play in NGB is nowhere near all of the crazy shinobier/whoever else/no hurt stuff that people have done. I'd really have to play alot more to try and get to a level like that.
I need to comment on this quote (I cant sleep otherwise lol). No-Hurt run make you spam cheap moves like UT and wall-spam so its actually not challenging to do them, ofcourse with all respect to them doing it.
Try do a OLB, no-UT, no-Ninpo and no-items run include all the fiends challenging (you can get hurt no problem)......this is a challenge to everyone lol, it hasent been done before I think or allmost sure of it.

Now I can sleep :D
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Re: Started playing this again.

Post by Kazama Jin » Wed Dec 19, 2012 4:36 pm

In my opinion, the most fun to be had with NGB for me is just no UT and no ninpo. To me, OLB no UT is crazy challenging for sure, but the creativity takes a backseat to practical no UT playing, which in my opinion probably isn't too far from wall jumping/izuna(without getting thrown OL) and Y to downed enemies(?) alot, if you want to be safe about it, and especially since NGBs wall jump is so abusable and safe.

That's what I enjoyed about NGB is making my own creative goals like, 100 ninja mission MN(potmn4 I think), TDS only, no health items, no UT or ninpo, no wall jumping attacks, (If you jump a wall, need to shuriken cancel Y), then try to land 180Y and 360Y (no UT) without getting damaged on recovery by setting it up when groups attack or counter attack. May sound limiting due to no health items but the mages will give you enough blue orbs to sustain a not-perfect practice.

That's the kind of stuff I'd enjoy doing. I'd play it with more emphasis on creative landing/spacing/timing than trying to do the most practical solution, or rather I guess I should say, I would enjoy making practical solutions out of stuff that probably isn't ideal unless you get good at timing them.

something like that. Anyways props to anybody doing OLB runs and stuff like that, that's hardcore with NGB's high damage on MN. Isn't it like 2 or 2 and a half cat FS's and you're dead with OLB?
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Re: Started playing this again.

Post by Murphy's Ghost » Wed Dec 19, 2012 4:44 pm

For sure an FS setting up another's neck-wrangle will wipe you out. Double FS I think either kills or leaves with a sliver.

Even on Hard with a couple LotTG's under my belt the cats in the Archive challenge could wipe me out in 3 or 4 solid hits. That was terrific fun, though.
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Re: Started playing this again.

Post by iraqoz » Wed Dec 19, 2012 5:32 pm

Exactly that what I ment by not abusing any cheap moves, well I think doing wall jump or ID without spamming is also part of the creativity/free combo you execute if you doing that. You right doing OLB, no, no, no on NGB/NGS or even NG2 is incrediably hard (Including all the Fiend challenges ofcourse). I believe its not impossible but it gonna take CRAZY dedication, time and skills (skill comes from practice IMO).

I was just pointing out that no-hurt run on a NG game is nothing than UT and cheap moves spam and not that challenging. Iam more like you I like to do no UT run mostly because Iam tired of UT spam that I always do when I play NG lol
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Re: Started playing this again.

Post by Ninja Noob » Thu Dec 20, 2012 1:46 am

Marsbar wrote:The other tip is that if you can't see the fiend on the screen they generally don't attack; and fiends that throw orbs (mages and berzerkers) wont attack you with them. So you can set Ryu in a corner, facing the corner, and wait. Eventually a fiend will get into the field of view and Ryu (you) get first crack at him. Ryu gives damage without taking any. Get back in the corner or a different corner and repeat. It doesn't even have to be a corner...anywhere you can put Ryu that is kinda out of the way will work. Ryu can also charge up to an ET/UT while parked in the corner waiting for the fiend to enter the field of view. Smart use of the camera (right stick) can be used to keep the fiends out of the field of view.

These techniques are really well illustrated in most of the videos...for sure in Reim's, Bigalski's, and Balbaid's. Pretty sure Reims videos explain what is going on when he does it.
Hey man I really appreciate your support!
This thing about the camera seems to be a delicious exploit. I think I discovered it when I fought the red dinos for the first time, but it doesn't seem to work everytime, because I often get charged by another dino from offscreen. But I trust what you say, you are an experienced player, so I'm missing something for sure, I'll check Reim's videos asap. But seriously, what do you think about camerasystem and management in this game? I've read on the combat faq that the camera is the most misunderstood thing in this game, so please explain to me what are the reason the camera is so strange. Personally, I don't have any kind of problem with it, but I admit that it felt a little strange in the beginning, so I'm curious to know what pro plaers think about it, and I'd like to learn other things about it that I'm missing.

About no UT play vs OLB play: I find the first to be more entertaining to watch, and much stylish. Of course I'm a noob so when I play I use a lot of cheap techniques and exploits, but I really enjoy to watch Iraqoz freestyle runs, and I'd like to watch a master ninja no UT no ninpo run on NGB. BTW, I found one about NGS one month ago I think. Basically, I agree with Iraqoz, and I like to see Kazama Jin runs. So, Kazama Jin, if you are going to do a no cheap run in NGB, and it happens you can record in some ways, please do ti!
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Re: Started playing this again.

Post by Kazama Jin » Thu Dec 20, 2012 1:03 pm

haha. Nah, I appreciate it, but I only have been messing around with recording some NG2 stuff. My chapter 11 run is posted on the ninja gaiden 2 forum, if you are wondering what I've been up to as far as no UT stuff is concerned.

Also, about the camera, I agree that it is missunderstood as a whole by gamers. In my opinion it's like this..

Gamers want to have games be easy, and accessible and fun to them. Fair enough, however, they also want an incredibly indepth combat system with years of replay value, and all of these other hardcore merits, and etc.. The problem I think was that people didn't understand that the camera is a skill you have to learn how to use right. It is a separate (all be it minor) skill that you have to build up and learn how to utilize for your own advantage. In order for NG to have the depth it has, the camera has to work the way it does.

It's like trying to learn how to play the piano but complaining that you can't see the entire keyboard at one time while playing something. In order for NG's crazy good auto-targetting and precise enemy selection to occur in a free form 3d action game environment, you have to have the camera the way it is, the player must learn it also. A set camera in NG would limit the players control greatly and totally destroy the gameplay in my opinion.

It's really not that hard to learn, it's very natural once you give it some time. You end up anticipating stuff off screen very easily, eventually.
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Re: Started playing this again.

Post by Marsbar » Thu Dec 20, 2012 4:53 pm

I agree with everything that Kazama Jim said. I never could see what people were griping about. Only time I really have problems with the camera is when Ryu is right up against the shimmery boundaries in some of the missions (Niccae and Ishtaros come to mind)

I don't know if these are tips, but......Use the Right Trigger to center your view and use it a lot.

There are spots in some of the levels that you can exploit. I'll use one encounter as an example. In Chapter 1 When you enter the room where the Samurai armor holding the key is there is an encounter to the right. It is just to the other side of a narrow hallway that opens into a small area in front of a door to the next part of the Dojo. Position Ryu a little way back from the end of the hallway and start charging a UT. Keep the camera focused on Ryu and away from the encounter. When you reach the UT, move the camera off Ryu and onto the end of the hallway. you should see ninja. Let go of the UT and you usually kill one if not all of the ninja. After you kill all the ninja don't absorb the essence. Go through the door and do an OL into the middle of the room. The essence will be "dragged" and you will start the next encounter with an ET/UT. Being able to start a fight with an ET/UT gives you a huge advantage and really makes the game more fun, imo.

Check 3:41 of this video
He is using the Lunar which you only have here if you are playing Master Ninja...but the Nunchaku and the DS also work well.
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Re: Started playing this again.

Post by Ninja Noob » Fri Dec 21, 2012 1:47 am

TGD: I like :D

Well, so he moves the camera that way just by tapping the right trigger? Is it because the corridor is norrow? Strange, because sometimes, when I center camera near a wall, I get a sort of first person camera. I have to try it.

Edit: where can I find old NGB vodeos from Reim and Bigalski?
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Re: Started playing this again.

Post by Murphy's Ghost » Fri Dec 21, 2012 3:11 am

^ Did you know you can toggle the camera mode but pushing in the right stick? It switches between right stick going to 'free look' FPS mode and right stick freely rotating the 3rd person camera.


Sometimes the camera just has a hiccup in tight spaces, too. For the most part it works fine, luckily.
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Re: Started playing this again.

Post by Ninja Noob » Fri Dec 21, 2012 3:40 am

Murphy's Ghost wrote:^ Did you know you can toggle the camera mode but pushing in the right stick? It switches between right stick going to 'free look' FPS mode and right stick freely rotating the 3rd person camera
LOL I didn't fucking knew this... now many things explain themself...
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Re: Started playing this again.

Post by iraqoz » Fri Dec 21, 2012 11:45 am

Murphy's Ghost wrote:^ Did you know you can toggle the camera mode but pushing in the right stick? It switches between right stick going to 'free look' FPS mode and right stick freely rotating the 3rd person camera.


Sometimes the camera just has a hiccup in tight spaces, too. For the most part it works fine, luckily.
wow REALLY didnt know that, it was one of things that pissed me off when I played NGB.....I have to try this
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